Talked to Niv, I corrected the fog emitters, actually never noticed they were put in.
True TR, I was quick on the draw there, but personally I think the SH placeables are a no brainer for a lot more building diversity, but the 3.01 wouldnt be released for a little while though and currently with the beauty of Windows 11 it has the to do list indebted where I document the things I do for CEP 3.01 and anything beyond, to also easily revert and remove should it be needed.
Please, someone, correct me if I’m wrong, but I’ve been looking at the above structure for building this new version of CEP and I’m wondering if backwards compatibility isn’t completely shattered. Allow me to explain.
Module A is running CEP 2.65. It’s been running CEP 2.65 for years and years.
Player A plays on Module A. Player A has CEP 2.65. No issues
Player A then downloads CEP 3.0. His cep_core haks have been replaced with CEP 3.0 core_haks (which are now empty shells). Player A then goes to play Module A. Technically it allows him to open the module/join the server, but all of the assets once associated with those 2.65 core haks are completely gone.
For module A has not associated itself with CEP 3.0 or been built with it, and by Module A’s reckoning, all of those assets are still in the core_1 through 7 cep haks.
Yeah, unless the module specifically updates to CEP 3.0, the player will just be sitting on a bunch of haks that potentially go to nothing.
As long as Player A keeps 2.x (which is now updated to 2.66 btw), they’ll still be able to play Module A. Its essentially the same dilemma players/builders face when CEP 2 came out. Each module/pw creator/builder will have to decide IF they want to upgrade their module/pw to CEP 3. However, unlike CEP 1, which ceased development when CEP 2 came along, CEP 2.x is still being updated and fixed.
If you’re a new builder/pw developer, I’d go with CEP 3. If you’ve been using CEP 2.65 and have a well-established module with its own custom haks build to sit atop CEP, you’ll have to evaluate if updating to CEP 3 is a necessity.
I’m also not too sure how well its going to sit with some players having 3 versions of CEP sitting on their computer: CEP 1 to play older modules that were never updated, CEP 2.x to play modules and pws using that, and then CEP 3 to play still more modules developed using that. Given the size of modern drives, this might not be an issue, BUT I’ve heard grumblings from many about having two versions of the same core content.
Yes, well, that is one issue, but I’m talking about the casual player who downloads 3.0 and it overwrites his previous core haks. Most casual players (and even your dedicated ones) won’t realize this. And so then there is the task of keeping multiple versions of haks with the same name and keeping updated versions from overwriting the previous…
I just don’t see how any of this meets the definition of backwards compatibility.
It doesn’t fit what is commonly defined as “backwards compatible” because all of the CEP3 haks have the prefix “cep3_” - they don’t overwrite any of the CEP 2.x haks.
From Winternite’s CEP3 project page:
Technically it is “compatible” with CEP 2.x in the sense that CEP3 does include all the content in CEP2. However, CEP3 is an INDEPENDANT project that has no dependability upon CEP 2. Thus, by commonly accepted definition, CEP3 is NOT backwards compatible because a Builder has to go in and change the HAKs in their module to “update” to CEP3. Were it truly meeting the common definition of “backward compatible”, a builder wouldn’t have to redo their haks and they could just download CEP3 and go. But that’s not the case…
So to summarize:
CEP3 is NOT CEP2 - they are different projects
CEP3 will NOT overwrite any haks downloaded as part of CEP2. I can’t speak for the tlk.
Using CEP3 requires that the CEP3 haks and tlk be specifically added to the module.
Since CEP3 uses the same core sturcture as CEP2, updating a module from CEP2 to CEP3 should be as easy as swapping out the haks and tlk.
When CEP 2.67 is released, bullet 4 may no longer be true as CEP 2.67 makes some changes to the CEP2 core haks as well as additions to the TLK.
With one of the patches, the Elder elementals don’t work due to the originals being overridden. Additionally everything using Ghoul animations does the new stance. There seems to be the base elemtnals from Q overriding the original ones but not in the Facelift haks? Also overrides the Iron golem with one of TAD’s ones
The Jade Falcon has one of its legs Ruby, not jade (Issue with the regular model, I might have a fix lying around if required)
Spitting Feldrake’s animations don’t appear hooked up properly
SirOtus’ Eye of the Deep has its jaw buggered, I think there’s a fixed one in his original pack? Eye of the Deep | The Neverwinter Vault
(Also going on there, two of the Eye of the Deep are on their own, while the last two are in Beholder but that is my fault to be honest given its my two in Beholder)
Beetle: Pack has the wrong envmap on him, can just be copied from the regular beetle’s 2da
Karandas shows up with a gryphon rather than his regular tail
Thanks Mecheon for info, I will look into the issues, if you have a fix for Jade Falcon please send me.
Managed to fix most of the listed items, with help from Pstemarie, as he is working on it also.
Currently missing Felldrake animation, and im not sure about the ghouls should be intentional animation change, as long as it doesnt break or bug out. As for the facelift haks those are mostly meant for overriding tilesets (forest, rurals, etc) and improving the loading screens.
OK, so I’ve been out of the community for a while and just became aware of the existence of CEP 3, and I have a straightforward question.
What’s the “business case” for developing a new version of CEP, instead of continuing to improve the old one? What’s different and better about CEP 3 that builders should adopt it?
I’m going to be starting work on curating Sanctum 1-2 and re-starting work on Sanctum 3 soon. If there’s a case for re-architecting the series in the process, now would be the time for me to consider it.