For Convos and Scripts - Module vs Campaign, any difference?

One thing I noticed while I was digging through my campaign was that I’ve put all the Conversations and Scripts into the Campaign folder. I’m sure I had a reason for doing this once upon a time, but I cannot recall what that reason was now.

I’m wanting to move the module specific scripts and convos to the modules they belong in, to make things a little clearer as I continue work, but I am wondering if this is unwise? I just wish I could remember why I put everything in the campaign folder…

Thanks all.

And another question: For assets, like tiles, 2DA, etc., where is the best place to place them? Override, Campaign, HAK (ultimately?)

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You probably put them in there to access them from everywhere, instead of just from their prespective modules. I do this for plot stuff which I need from module to module. If a side quest though for example takes place all in one module, then I leave the files in the module.

p.s Good to see you man :slight_smile:

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Thanks Andy.

Another question: I need to export the color scheme for a tile so I can apply it to other tiles. I can’t remember how to do that.

For the other question,

campaign overrides module, override folder overrides campaign and hak overrides override folder.
I will tell you what I use.
I use the override folder only for temporary fixes when I am testing something and I will not release my work by saying “place these files in your override folder”.
I place all models like tiles etc in the campaign folder (which is like an override after all).
2da files I also place in my campaign because I need to work on them regularly, but when I release they will probably go in a hak.

The way I think about it, players are less likely to mess with a hak file, so if you want your assets to be safe… place them in a hak. It has a disadvantage, that if something breaks you cannot override it anymore since hak tramps everything. Also, many placers mess with the override folder and files you put in there that are necessary to your work can get messed up. That’s why most campaigns get released by saying “empty your override folder before playing”.

In any case, that’s just what I do. I know others place everything in haks or release with instructions for override. I just want to have an option to override my files in need be (like a patch).

About the color scheme… I guess kamal could drop by and help you :). I’m clueless.

So one of the interesting problems I ran into right away was with Kamal’s Tileset. If I install it into the Override folder, they all show up in the toolset. If I install them in the campaign, they do not show up in the toolset. Do I need to configure something in the Toolset to make sure the campaign loads correct? Is it just not loading or something?

I’d much rather have things in the Campaign folder than in the override.

Hmm, I wouldn’t think it plays a role. Override or campaign folder should load them just the same.

You can still use the override folder for assets. It’s the models that need to be in a release folder. For example I have UTP files (placeables) in my override and their models in my campaign folder. Even if the player doesn’t get these UTP files, they’ll still show in game.

Okay. Well, this is really weird because when the files are in the Campaign folder, the toolkit doesn’t see them. I’ll have to Google around.

I think your best bet is for someone here to drop by :). I bet someone has had this problem before.

It appears to have fixed itself. I had two shortcuts for the toolset on my desktop. I deleted the second one and used the first one, and I noticed a significantly longer startup time. It grabbed all the assets in my Campaign folder and now all the tiles show up. So there we go.

Good to know. Have fun modding :slight_smile:

I’m sure the fun part will return, eventually, but lord do I have a lot to catch up on. I’ve forgotten so much.

It’s nice to have a snappy computer to work with though. I just wish I’d have never laid off the project. Even an hour a day to keep my brain fresh with the Toolset would have been a wise time investment.

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Yeah I know the feeling. For me it was last summer. I opened the toolset and didn’t know how to rotate the camera. But it all comes back quickly. The toughest thing is to remember how an NPC is called etc. The funniest feeling is, playing it and not remembering how an NPC is going to react to your actions. I often caught myself smiling at the screen thinking “Damn, I don’t remember writing this :smiley:

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Figured out the big problem - I actually had NWN2 Complete installed to two locations (hence why I had two Toolset shortcuts). So deleting one helps LOL

I only use the override folder for testing new elements like models or effects. For a module or campaign I stick with .hak files, organized into multiple categories (tiles, creatures, sounds, 2da, &c.) for managing file size and ease of update.

I’m not sure if somebody mentioned this reason already, but I found the best way to develop a module/campaign was to move all files (scripts and conversations) into a campaign folder. This meant you can easily “patch” a game because newer campaign files do not require “hak” fixes. Simply replace any existing campaign file with the newer version and you are good to go again - unless severely changed. i.e. Change campaign files on an existing save game works fine. In some “rare” instances, I have even been able to update files “live”, like when my wife was experiencing an issue, I could change them via the network “live” and she could carry on.

When I realised this advantage, I did the opposite to what you originally proposed and ended up moving all my “module” files into “campaign” files to make the work easier for myself and for players trying to keep up to date. :slight_smile:

For the same reason as above, I keep as many of these resources in the campaign folder. However, some of them do not work this way and so you need to “test” which ones do and which ones don’t. The majority work just fine. I believe it is the “build” type resources (e.g. tile sets) that (for obvious reasons) need to be “in place” before the rest of the campaign files load.

I would say check out my module for example, but it’s not available just yet - will hopefully become available soon. Then you can see the files I was able to place into the campaign folder - it was a lot of resources!

Tilesets require a top priority and so you would need to make sure they have their own hak alongside your module.

Don’t forget that if you release your module with a “priority” hak (that sits above all others), then you CAN further fix haks because any files placed in the priority hak overrides the same file in lower set haks. That was the point of the “patch” system I implemented and explained: https://worldofalthea.blogspot.com/2009/02/patching-module.html

I edited my question because I hadn’t realized that hak are read in order. So from what you are saying the patch hak should be the first on the list of module haks?

I have a question though. You said campaign files can be patched by being replaced. Does that mean that if I talk to an NPC and his convo breaks, I can fix it and replace the file, load my save before talking to him and he will have a new fixed convo?

[quote=“andysks, post:18, topic:1844, full:true”]Does that mean that if I talk to an NPC and his convo breaks, I can fix it and replace the file, load my save before talking to him and he will have a new fixed convo?
[/quote]

That’s the way it’s supposed to work, yes. Check the link that Lance provided about patching.

I intend to eventually move most things to HAKs, just because of the patching mechanism. Campaign is fine for everything, but then you have to download the whole thing to patch it (or users have to be smart enough to know to just drop files into the Campaign). I want to make things as easy as possible for users, and the HAK system seems to do that.

The problem I have with keeping all the conversations in the Campaign folder is that it just gets unruly. I really only want companion and global conversations in the Campaign folder, and everything else is module specific.

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Yes, you can change all campaign files and they will fix any issues you had. It’s the way I do all my patching at the moment. As colorsfade says next, the biggest issue is that you end up changing the entire folder for players (because it is easier to do this than try to explain those that should be updated) - possibly a sledge hammer to fix a minor issue. HOWEVER, I still prefer this at the moment, as at least I know the player has all the files, and is not missing one I “forgot” to put in the hak. (And as I said above, some files can even be changed while a player is still playing (not even come out of the game)! I did this for my wife on the LAN so she did not have to wait for the full upload and could carry on playing. This does not always work, but it is sure useful when it does. Conversations, if I recall correctly, are one of those I changed for her so she could have a correct response when she discovered a bug.) She simply came out of the conversation, I then copied/overwrote the conversation file, and she went back and continued the conversation - and it was fixed!

However, the “hak” patching system is otherwise the most efficient method I found for fixing when only a few files are involved (which is the aim eventually). The problem is that if you have a number of fixes (and you have files in both module and campaign format), then you can (at least I can) forget which files may have already been “patched” and keeping track becomes a “burden” in itself. Lumping them all into campaign folder and just uploading the lot takes away the added pressure.

That said, I still keep my empty hak in place just in case I get to the point where the simpler fix (after an otherwise finally tuned campaign has been built) is still required. :wink: