PRC Lite and NWNCX


#81

Not particularly, since single-player modifications aren’t too common and tend to be graphical instead of changing core classes.

It seemed like a good practice to me, was all, but the more I consider it, the more I realize any actual compatibility issues would come from the .tlk more than anything else, and there’s no way around that, anyway.


#82

Yes tlk is killer. Especially because it is not so uncommonly used in single player story modules. (At least I made my tlk compatible with cep).

But we already discussed the possibility of using modified dialog.tlk. That solution is however again used by other projects which modifies vanilla rules…

Probably best idea is to code a dynamic merge/update, but so far I wasn’t able to make fully work 2das, tlk would be probably even harder to modify.

EDIT: BTW I am close to finishing Warlock - do you know anything about this class? Any suggestions?


#83

Unfortunately, I don’t know very much about 3e’s version of Warlock as I never played one in PnP, and I only messed around with the PRC version for a short while. My biggest concern is balance, since Invocations and Eldritch Blast are infinite use, but if the player is unable to swap out lower level Invocations like you said, that might actually help even things out.


#84

Version 2.1 released.

Fixed Empowered Turning (was indeed nonfunctional), Sacred Vengeance (previously Divine Vengeance, but it should be named Sacred) and Disciple of the Sun.

And I added Warlock.

About implementation:

  • Warlock is using original spellbook GUI and he works as spontaneous spellcaster.
  • All his spells are unlimited, they use concentration, and they respect spell resistance (with few exceptions).
  • Warlock will ignore spell failure in light amor. Unlike PRC, this feature will not apply when casting arcane spell from another class (if you multiclass warlock with sorcerer or bard for some reason…) Arcane spell failure from shield or heavier armor will still apply normally.
  • Warlock can cast spells defensively.
  • I didn’t copied all invocations from original PRC (way too many and too specific or almost useless anyway), instead I took invocations from NWN2 but I used original PRC code as a base.
  • Warlock cannot exchange invocations.
  • Warlock cannot learn more invocations via feats; ie. the feats to increase number of invocations that were in original PRC are not available and I don’t plan to add them.
  • From epic feats specific to warlock, except epic fiendish resilience and epic eldritch blast, only Lord of all Essences is available.
  • Warlock can select two new general feats: Practiced spellcaster and Battle Caster (extends his armor casting ability to medium armor). Battle Caster is not available to bard (since I didn’t give him the same feature as Warlock - no vanilla class modifying)
  • Warlock can level up as Acolyte of the Skin and the prestige class willl improve his spellcasting - but it will work as with Sorcerer: prestige class increases the caster level and spell gain/known but player needs to level up with sorcerer (in our case warlock) to make use of it and select spells known from the gained levels.

Specific invocation/feats notes:

  • Fiendish resilience gives regeneration in different ammount than what states manual. This is because, if I understand this correctly, the fast healing ability which is what he should get works as regenerate per 1 turn. That means, that at level 8 he should heal total 2 hitpoints over 2 minutes. 10 hitpoints over 2 minutes at lvl 18. And that is absolutely terrible. On the other hand, with epic fiendish resilience this turns overpowered in original PRC. So I made a house rule, it will apply classic 6second regeneration which will be +1, +2 at 13, +3 at 18 and +1 each 5 levels thereafter. So this way it will heal total 20 hitpoints at lvl 8 and 60 at 18. Each epic feat will add +1 and duration will be changed to 5 minutes (no it won’t stack).
  • Lord of all Essences is passive feat. The benefit of using two eldritch essences at once is automatic and thus always turned on. This is my house rule, it seemed to me to be just annoying if it had to be toggled before… Even with haste that is 2 full rounds before making eldritch blast with 2 essences.
  • least invocation Leaps and Bonds grants +4 dexterity. This is a house rule from NWN2 because normally it should improve 3 skills by +6 but only one skill exists in NWN. Though, I am thinking +4 is too much maybe and it will also not line with other similar skill invocations - maybe each skill invocation should add +2 ability and 1 skill?
  • Dark One’s Own Luck grants bonus to all saving throws, again NWN2 house rule. I was lazy to make 3 sub-spells. But it is in TODO list…

Known issues:

  • Caster level will probably not be adjusted by Acolyte of the Skin class. It should probably work for normal invocations like wall of perilous flame, but it will not work in eldritch blast, chain, cone and doom.
  • Eldritch blast incorrectly ignores spell resistance/spell mantle.
  • Imbue Item selection shows some spells like polymorph multiple times.
  • When levelling up as Warlock, metamagic feats become available, even though warlock has no use of them.

Finally, some of my own experiences about this class. I must say I found it quite balanced actually. While he can cast unlimited times, the spell selection is not that great, particulary defensive buffs are lacking. He has only 3 spells on each level. On the other hand, the possibilites of the eldritch blast, essences and blast upgrades are so fun to play with. With right choice of invocations he can be very versatile.
Imo the most overpowered and interestng ability is Imbue Item. This feat usefullness vary depending on availability of empty potion, bone wand and blank scroll. But in modules where you can acquire these items, warlock can craft wand and potion with any vanilla spell. This way while he lacks the defensive spells in his own repertoair, he can craft wands for each ability spell, improved insibility or death ward. He can create scroll of Shapechange or MD. So many possibilities. I want to play him somewhere…


#85

Warlock is not available to be selected. I opened up the .hak to check the 2da, and it’s not in there, but the hak is filled with other warlock relevant files. You might have accidently put an older Classes.2da in.

EDIT: Sacred Vengeance and Discipline of The Sun aren’t fix in this, either. The .tlk is updated, however, and Divine Vengeance appears as Sacred Vengeance now.

Also, if this is CEP Compatible now, then it should work with the Aielund Saga, which I hear is good. Swordflight uses a few .haks, but doesn’t touch the .tlk, so it should work with that, too, and I can vouch for that series being excellent.


#86

Ah too bad. I put old hak into package, thats what happens when you managing2 versions.

should be fixed now, LINK


#87
  • Discipline of the Sun doesn’t seem to work still, it spits out a message about PvP settings. I’m guessing it’s set to focus on the user, like Fist of Iron was?

  • All Seeing Eyes lacks an icon.

  • Flee The Scene causes an odd loop where the character continually casts the Major Image portion of the spell once they arrive at their destination. They’re unable to move from the spot and are locked into casting the spell over and over. The debug log is spammed with the spell being cast.

  • Noxious Blast lacks an icon.

  • Fiendish Resilience lacks an icon.

  • Entropic Warding doesn’t seem to apply the concealment bonus against ranged attacks.

  • Hideous Blow doesn’t apply to weapons, the log says that they’re not a valid target for the spell.

  • Voracious Dispelling removes spells, but doesn’t deal damage to the target.

  • Devour Magic seems to remove spells, but does not grant temporary hit points to the caster.

  • It’s difficult to tell if Retributive Invisibility works, as without another PC to try and dispel it.

  • Word of Changing works correctly, but it could use a more informative description. It currently doesn’t say what the target saves vs.


#88

The spell is supposed to be cast at creature.


#89

So it is, I checked and it works correctly.


#90

Version 2.1b released

All reported issues should be fixed except description for word of changing. Please submit your suggestion I was unable to formulate anything good.

Additionally I removed the possibility to cast on item and self from hideous blow, eldritch blast, spear, chain and cone (as the spell has no effect on item and it makes no sense to cast it on self).

And I reworked Imbue Item in order to make it easier to use it repeatedly. So now, player first must use imbue item on himself - which will show up conversation where he select spells. After this spell is selected, it is stored. When imbue item is cast on craftable item and the spell was stored, it will attempt to craft the item with that spell.


#91

“You utter a powerful word, forcing a targeted creature to assume a harmless form. The targeted creature must make a successful Fortitude saving throw or be transformed.”

I couldn’t think of much either, but IMHO it’s important the player knows what saving throw the invocation targets

Discipline of the Sun and Devour Magic work properly, however Voracious Dispelling still doesn’t seem to deal damage.

EDIT: Just noticed, after the most recent release, Hideous Blow is no longer able to target creatures. It can be used on the caster and objects, however.

EDIT 2: Lord of All Essences works properly, but it appears as a usable ability in the radial menu. Trying to activate it does nothing, but I’m still able to use two essences once I take it.

EDIT 3: Eldritch Spear is also unable to target creatures. It might be worth checking most most targeting abilities/spells to see if they were broken. In addition, I just noticed that Champion of Bane doesn’t receive any version of Divine Wrath but the first, I.E, at level 10 they still only get a +3 to damage/AB/saves from it, rather than the +5 they should.


#92

No new content right now, I am working on improving existing stuff.

And I need a suggestion for one issue.

Acolyte of the Skin should be granted the possibility to choose whether he wants +2STR or +2CON at epic levels he gets Physical Power feat and +2CHAR or +2INT at epic levels he gets Mental Power feat.

Currently, there is no choice, but the Mental Power grants ability based on spellcasting classes character has: it if has sorcerer or bard (and warlock but he is missing in the code right now) feat will grant +2 char, otherwise it is +2int.

Considering the class can be taken not just by sorcerer and wizard but also bard, cleric, druid and warlock I think it would be really cool if player get to choose what he wants. It would added more options to the character building.

Question is, how to do that. There are 3 options:

  1. Grant character +1 to both abilities instead. This would be not optimal but in the end more versatile than how it is currently.
  2. Conversation after levelup where the player makes the selection.
  3. A bonus feat based solution. This would be ideal, if it would worked the way I want. Unfortunately this solution has a lot of drawbacks:
  • player can choose any epic bonus feat instead of the feats I want him to select from. Script can force player to redo feat selection if he doesn’t choose one of the two, but in this case, if player want to take epic weapon focus instead of +2str I would let him. Still, thats not what should be possible.
  • if made this way, player will be able to take mental power instead of physical power and vice versa. Basically the second option that player didn’t take will be granted as a choice again at next level where player gets one of the two feats. Ie. at 11 player chooses str over con, at 16 where he should be selecting char and int he will also be able to select con. Again I can force player to redo levelup, but thats not ideal.

EDIT: I think I just give +2 to both abilities, it would be stronger than it should, but well it is epic and who wants these bonuses needs to invest a lot of levels into acolyte class so why not. And the versatility increases.


#94

I remember the old PRC having issues where it would force you to relevel if you took an ‘invalid’ feat, and it was extremely annoying. it’s not possible to let the player properly choose through the feat selection menu, simply giving a +2 to both might be the way to go.

It’s not nearly as strong as it sounds. For a Sorcerer, Bard and Wizard, it’s +1 to the DC of their spells, and either +1 to a stat that’s useless for them (Charisma for Wizard) or an extra skill point each time they level up from then on for everyone else, though I’m unsure if the bonus is actually done that way. Since it appears as an enchantment on the character sheet, they might not get the +1 skill point from the Int modifier. If that’s the case, worrying about its balance is pointless, since only a Wizard can really make use of the bonus outside of module-specific attribute checks.

EDIT: As for not choosing one of the feats during level up, it’s very possible for a Weapon Master to avoid taking Weapon of Choice entirely depending what level they are when they should get it, and I think even Ranger can avoid taking Favored Enemy once or twice at high levels. This is also a problem in the base game, so it wouldn’t be too unusual.


#95

Yes yes, right now it doesn’t grant skill points or spell uses/slots, but I am reworking it and the ability bonuses will be “hard”

I could do that from start, but at that time I wanted PRC Lite to work with Enforce Legal Characters server option.

Considering this project seems underrated and overlooked mainly because NWN:EE and also because it requires scripts from community patch + specific plugin which almost nobody who still runs PW for 1.69 want to use, I guess it doesn’t matter anymore anyway. And I expect this to be used only in singleplayer where ELC is not an issue.

But yes the extra ability bonuses probably aren’t that op.and while you technically can get +2 dex +8 con, +6 str, +4char and +4int it requires 20-30 levels of acolyte to get this which limits the possible powerbuilds a lot. On the other hand, unlike RDD this class has a sense to pick after its 10th level.


#96

Indeed - this is why PRC has to use that ugly delevel workaround. In fact, this workaround is used in PRCLite as well, Warlock has to choose 2 of 5 feats at lvl 10, but if the 10th level would be picked at epic level with general bonus feat he would be ableto pick 2 epic bonus feats for free.

I don’t know whether this is intentional in base NWN or not - I guess nobody saw it as an issue because if you don’t take Weapon of CHoice at 1st WM lvl you gain nothing out of it. And ranger is actually quite weak class and this feature helps him to catch up.

I could fix this issue easily (well maybe not that easily, but I am sure I will be able to do it) but I think that it wouldn’t be desired by many…


#97

It seems like most PWs still running have their own systems in place anyway, but PRC Lite is lightweight enough and easily installable that it can still be used for co-op, but ELC isn’t as big of an issue in that case anyway.

I never noticed the delevel workaround with Warlock, but I haven’t tried anything too unorthodox with it yet. Acolyte of the Skin getting a large number of attribute bonuses isn’t that powerful, when it’s being compared to the likes of Pale Master and Elemental Savant, and Acolyte needs a much larger investment to reach that point like you said.


#98

New version released, here is changelog:

  • Imbue Item conversation won’t show some spells more times anymore
  • invocation will now be used with their innate level against spell mantle and spell level immunity (was the spellbook spell level), likewise
  • fixed spell resistance/immunity to work on eldritch blast, this will also properly respect the spell level increase from shape or blast invocations
  • added polymorphing visual effect into word of changing invocation
  • fixed hideous blows, eldritch chain and eldritch spear to be usable on creatures again
  • fixed divine wrath not calculating champion of bane levels properly
  • reworked warlock dispel spells, should work properly now, also they now count spell level of the dispelled AOE spell
  • reworked racial type changes: character can change his race only once, the info about character original race is now kept in database instead of skin (that way losing skin will not affect persistency of this feature)
  • reworked sneak attack of PRC classes: now, both Arcane Trickster and Black Flame Zealot gets their own feat such as “Sneak Attack, Arcane Trickster 1d6” which will increase properly at each level. This will stack with rogue sneak and will allow player to take Improved Sneak Attack feat with combination of rogue/bg/assassin+arcane trickster or black flame zealot that gives at least 8d6 sneak (note this doesn’t work immediately on the level where you achieve the combination, but next). Practically nothing changes, technically this new solution is more clean and transparent to the player (no more feat cluttering in character sheet), also the solution no longer uses PC Skin but NWNX feature - this avoids any potential issues with PC Skin being lost.
  • acolyte of the skin bonuses to ability score will be now granted permanently (until now they have been granted as ability increase effect which will ignore +12 cap - however as such they didn’t granted more spell uses/slots and didn’t count for feat prerequisites)
  • acolyte’s Physical Power now gives +2str and +2con and Mental Power +2int and +2char
  • fixed prerequisites for two weapon defense and oversized two weapon fighting
  • fixed bug where AC from two weapon defense never went away
  • reworked versatile two-weapon fighting (no longer gives bonus feats on weapon, should work much reliable and safer now)
  • reworked elemental savant:
    – disallowed to take more than one elemental specialty feat (script will delevel player in such case)
    – bonus feats each 4lvl (was incorrectly 3)
    – new abilities at epic levels (polymorph into elemental shape, damage reduction and ability increase +2 str/dex/con based on chosen elemental)
    – more choices for bonus feats

Additional notes:

Black Flame Zealot, Arcane Trickster and Elemental Savant at epic level won’t get new feats automatically. Player must delevel and relevel to get them, and without the new feats, player won’t get the benefits anymore.

I made Elemental Savant as closes PnP as possible. However there is one significant alteration over Epic levels implementation from official source. In PnP, elemental savant, and this apply to all classes actually, should get Great Ability feats as bonus feats only for abilities that the class increases - that is strength, constitution and dexterity. And that is only under condition of the chosen elemental, ie. earth can take strength only, water constitution only and air/fire dexterity only.

First of all, this condition is not implementable. That is without delevelling player when he chooses wrong, which is ugly workaround I won’t choose.
Secondly, elemental savant already can take Great Intelligence, Charisma and Wisdom - this is incorrect per PnP, however all spellcasting classes, base and prestige in vanilla NWN can take Great Ability for casting ability.

In my opinion, without changing all vanilla classes to use 3.5 PnP rules, it makes no sense exclude Great Intelligence/Charisma/Wisdom from spellcasting prestige classes’ bonus feat lists.
And because Elemental Savant therefore allows to take int, char and wis already I was hesistant to give him the 3 remaining abilities - as he would then be able to select all of them.


#100
  • Champion of Bane’s Divine Wrath now works correctly, and Word of Changing has VFX attached, but Hideous Blow and Eldritch Spear still cannot target creatures.

  • A character’s race lists Dwarf in game on the character sheet, but not during chargen or when selecting from the vault. I’m guessing this has to do with the racial type changes. Characters retain racial abilities, it seems as though only the label changes.

  • Attempting to take an Epic Spell feat as Arcane Trickster or Elemental Savant causes a relevel, even when I can select it as a bonus feat. I noticed a “Character has too many feats” message in the log.

  • Arcane Trickster’s sneak attack doesn’t seem to apply, they do far less sneak attack damage then they should.

  • Acoylte’s Symbiosis dropped my Constitution from 22 to 20. The character started with 18 at chargen and never increased it, for reference.

  • Acolyte’s Mental Power caused my Wisdom to jump from 8 to 30. It later jumped to 39 at Acolyte level 26.

  • Acolyte receives Epic Acolyte of the Skin again at level 30.

  • Elemental Savant’s Ability Increase also seems broken, the Air version dropped my Constitution from 18 to 16.

  • Elemental Savant changes racial type to Elemental and Acolyte changes it to Outsider, as intended, despite the other issues with racial types.


#101

just a quick reply:
epic spells - i see, the delevel is from community patch script as an anti-exploit, i need to add new prestige classes into the check
all the problems with abilities - i think this has to do something with racial ability modifiers, i was only testing this on human and it worked correctly… will investigate
sneak attack - it worked for me properly, do you have the new sneak attack feats? did you overwrite nwncx_patch with the new one from v2.2 package?


#102

I overwrote the patch. The character has sneak attack 5d6 and Arcane Trickster Sneak attack 12d6, along with Improved Sneak Attack 3. The highest physical damage I saw from sneak attack, Impromptu or otherwise was 53. My expectations might be off, but I remember Sneak Attack doing noticeably more damage in previous versions.