That a person can read a scroll isn’t enough to make it work. In AD&D (2e) Thieves already had a Read Languages ability. And there were no Bards. The idea was that Thieves are clever and capable and tend to learn what they need to to allow them to survive despite inherent squishiness. So post-2e I think UMD was developed as a mechanic to remove the need for thieves to dual-class with magic-user and the existing “Read Languages” skill justifies something like UMD except that they wanted to make this new ability cost something, so they tied it to Charisma, which is an attribute most Thieves would not care about. If they had tied it to Intelligence it would have been free.
You are a saint among demons. I call for you to take over Ao’s place as the Overgod.
So at the end of the day, it all falls down to gameplay mechanics.
D&D sounds really cool, but even it is corrupt.
Ok not really, but you get what I mean.
It is a tradeoff for mechanics I think. With AD&D I always played an elf or half-elf multi-class fighter/magic-user/thief. What I really wanted was someone like the Gray Mouser, a talented street thief with a taste for magic who wears little armor and fights mainly with a rapier and a dirk, but I also wanted him to be able to use a variety of weapons because a rapier is no good against skeletons. So to get all of that I had to go with multi-classing and that meant I had to use an elf or half-elf, and I had to have high Dex and Int.
If I had played 3.5 I could have gotten nearly all of that with a rogue with high Int, Dex, Char and UMD. No need to dual-class or multi-class, which also means no race limitations. So more player flexibility, but not entirely for free because I need to sink some points into Char and UMD to get the magic skills. A rogue who spits on magic wouldn’t need the Char or UMD, and could be a better rogue. I suspect the Bard was yet another attempt to get what I am describing except you compromise on some of the rogue abilities.
How much UMD does thy character actually need? Is the charisma bonus truly necessary for thy build?
The NWN2wiki says:
- equip restricted items: 11 points
- use restricted wand: 10 points
- use restricted scroll: generally 11 + 2x spell level
The charisma modifier would be handy to have. At least you would not want a penalty.
She says this almost every time weather alive or dead.
Higher Charisma helps the skills bluff, diplomacy and intimidate. These are also Rouge skills, not just Bards. If you get caught picking someones pocket you maybe able to talk your way out of trouble easier if you have a higher Charisma then if it is say a 10 or less. That modifier can be a life saver in game.
I have experimented a bit on nwn2db with builder, with starting stats (Race: lightfoot halfling) as follows:
Pure rogue will get 363 skill points, which is enough to max out 11 skills. Certainly, if UMD was getting bonus from INT, he could have saved a bit (I chose to raise DEX only in builder and thus INT bonus is but 1 point higher, than CHA bonus), but how I feel it, that seems enough skills.
How to master rouge skills:
Reminds me of rogue and rouge puns.
Verily, thou speaketh sooth.
I had great hopes that Rogue One would fix this, but alas twas not meant to be.
Colorblindness is a major disadvantage for rouges.
If you’ve read Roger Zelazney’s “Amber” series of novels you will realise that the gunpowder substitute of “Jeweller’s Rouge” is a direct antecedent of smoke powder in D&D.
Never said it wasn’t good to have, but for Rogues, it’s typically secondary, since their goal is to not get caught at all.
Guess I shouldn’t be a Rogue, then, 'cuz apparently colorblindness isn’t a major disadvantage to everyone.
Hrm, I always felt that your high Use Magical Device character was basiclly talking the magic device into functioning. In P&P a high charisma character with a philter of glibness and a few low level illusion spells is nearly the equivelent of a reality-warper. The uttely outlandish things they can convince NPC’s of, if only for a short while, borders on the surreal.
You basicly tricked the item into functioning through raw persuasion.
to further stress the role of Charisma, monsters will use it for the DC of their spellabilities.
only mobs with an actual spell-casting class use Int or Wis
I side w/ Kaldor on this one: it’s a “balance” issue,
// ------------------------------------------------------------------------- // We only punish rogues, so other classes cast for free :) // -------------------------------------------------------------------------
An interesting theory indeed.
What would be thy opinion on my earlier statement (based on Max Weber’s definition of Charisma), that Charisma represents inborn talents (and talent of speech is only one of them), rather than only oratory skills?
“Hey… You wanna work for me, gorgeous…?”
“I’m a scroll”
“… Oh my Ao, you’re so charming, I can’t resist. METEOR SWARM!”
Or even worse:
“You’re gonna cast your spell on my enemies!”
“You’re not a spellcaster”
“You’re gonna do it!”
“Screw you, I’m casting the spell right now. METEOR SWARM!… Wait, what?!”